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Lucius
Posted on Monday, May 09, 2005 - 07:25 pm:   

Mention should be made of the greatest lightweight fight I, personally, have ever seen. It occurred last weeked in Las Vegas. Diego Corrales and the champion, Jose Castillo, fought for ten rounds and Corrales prevailed by tenth round stoppage, but that hardly tells the story. They fought toe to toe for ten rounds, landing ferocious punches, both men rocking the other several times. After nine, I had Castillo slightly ahead. In the tenth, Castillo knocked Corrales down twice, and had him in serious trouble, But Castillo, looking to finish, got careless and Corrales caught him with a left hook, followed up with several more clean punches, and the ref stopped the fight. I think Castillo will take the rematch, he's the stronger, more varied fighter; but this may be wishful thinking, because I think Corrales is a punk. Not so long ago, he put his 90 pound wife, who was 8 months pregnant, in the hospital with a dreadful beating that included throwing her down a flight of stairs. But that doesn't diminish the fact that it was a great fight.
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Nels
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 04:11 am:   

Salivated about this, ponificated endlessly, promised myself I'd avoid the web until it's shown in this country (Friday), couldn't resist looking... From all accounts, what a fight. Can't wait to see it.

From what I've read I take it Corrales learned the ol' "there goes my mouthpiece" trick from Mr Freitas. Can't blame him -- war's war, man -- but yeah I wanted Jose Luis to win this. From all accounts Diego got a pounding, though...

All the best,

Nels.

PS: What's your take on Winky-Tito, Lucius? The golden days are here, man. We're living them.

PPS: Heavyweights? What are these heavyweights people speak of? There are divisions above twelve and a half stone? How quaint...
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 05:21 am:   

Yeah, Nels, re the mouthpiece, like my old boxing coach said, If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying. This is the fucking textbook on infighting. You're gonna love it.

I kind of like Tito. I don't think Winky can hurt him and I think Tito will walk him down and win by late stoppage -- but Winky's cute, and if he makes it a boring fight, it could be close.

The Heavweights....they're not even jokes. M y f riend Hank Kaplan, while watching the Klitschko-Sanders mess, described K's punching style as -- "It's like he's trying to snatch a paper out of a campfire." These guys, and I may be stepping on toes here, even Lewis, are just too big and stiff too fight. They're sad and unlovely, like dancing bears,
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 06:51 am:   

Corrales-Castillo, probably fight of the year, definitely round of the year. Weirdest thing I've seen in 15 years of serious fight-watching.

The big debate point on this one is whether Tony Weeks should have given Chico extra recovery time after the second knockdown by replacing the mouthpiece. A bunch of folks I know (some of whom have inside knowledge of reffing) feel Weeks made an error and gave Corrales a chance to marshall his energy. He clearly beat the count on the first KD but was shaky for the second. My guess is the right way to go should have been a warning for spitting out the gumshield, no opportunity to replace after KD #2. Maybe he felt that deducting a point w/o a warning entitled Corrales to have his mouthpiece put back in. Who knows?

What is clear is that it was the craziest ending to a title fight in recent memory, Corrales definitely stopped Castillo (was this the first time?) and there will be a rematch that, in all likelihood, will be a much tamer, more conservative affair than the experts expect.

Most of the bout reminded me of Nelson-Fenech I, the most intense phone booth war I've ever seen between little guys.
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 07:04 am:   

The thing is, that was the third time in the bout that Corrales spit out the mouthpiece. Check out the eighth round. He starts to spit it out, gets it halfway back in, and then it gets knocked out.

I'm with the people who say that a knockdown does not constitute a lull in the action -- I think Castillo would have KOed him if he hadn't been given that extra time.

If there's a rematch, I doubt it'll be much tamer. Castillo doesn't know any other way to fight --he' s not going to suddenly become a boxer --and once he's hit, Corrales reverts...
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 07:47 am:   

I am in the process of being swayed that Chico caught a break, should not have had the gumshield replaced, and got extra time to recover.

The question I am trying to get answered now is: is the mouthpiece rule hard and fast, or subject to ref's discretion? Was it a miscarriage of justice, or just a bad break on a ref's judgment call?
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 08:11 am:   

The unified rules say that a mouthpiece should be replaced "at the first opportune moment" and in a manner not to interfere with "the immediate action." Unless the ABC offers training that amplifies on these points my guess is that it is a gray area that is open to ref's discretion. Either Corrales was very lucky or very crafty, depending on how devious you think he and his team are and how well they research ref's tendencies. Do you think Joe Goosen had the savvy to tell Diego "Tony will give you a break if you lose your mouthpiece, so if you get in trouble, spit it out?"
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, May 10, 2005 - 09:07 am:   

Everything in boxing is a gray area. Like I said, I know no one except KD who considers a knockown a lull....

I think Diego spit it out all on his own.
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JV
Posted on Saturday, May 14, 2005 - 02:17 pm:   

Excited about the Wright-Trinidad fight tonight? I kinda feel Wright's consistency will prevail over Trinidad's power punching. Am I wrong?

I mean, Trinidad's fight again Mayorga (sic?)--I don't think that proved too much, because M. has always been a guy with a big heart, a rock-hard chin, and a big punch...but not a whole lot of skill.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, May 14, 2005 - 06:29 pm:   

I think Winky's a cutie, but he doesn;t have enough power to keep Tito off him. I'm leaning toward Tito walking him down, but it's a slight lean...
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, May 14, 2005 - 08:59 pm:   

Sound like you got this one right--from reading the internet reports it's Winky in a real snoozer. Glad I didn't buy it.
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JV
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 06:42 am:   

Actually, I thought it was a pretty entertaining fight. One-sided, but always with that threat of Tito landing a big punch. And watching Winky execute his game plan to perfection was interesting. It was fascinating how bad the advice was that Tito got in his corner, and how good the advice in Winky's corner.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 07:01 am:   

I've watched Winky ever since he won his frist belt from Bronco McKart and, uh, seen one Winky fight, seen 'em all. He's always executes his plan. It's interesting, but it's in no way compelling. Every round the same. If Tito can't beat him, he should obviously retire, because he would have beat him early on. Tito's corner has always been horrid. Not as horrid as Tyson's corner in the Lewis fight, but close.


The problem is, now we have Hopkins-Wright to look forward to? That's an absolute dog of a fight. I like the science of boxing as much as anyone, but Hopkins-Wright promises that there'll be about ten punches landed a round, 12 rounds of it. Maybe Jermain Taylor will spare us, but even if he doesn't, I wonder if Hopkins will take the fight. There'll be no money. It'll go to purse bids, and I doubt that Hopkins will go for that.

Thank god for Hatton-Tzyu. I know you think Tzyu will win, but it should be fun while it lasts.

BTW, the best pound-for-pound guy in boxing, IMO, is fighting at the end of the month. Rafael Marquez, Juan's little bro. Trouble is, it's on a PPV card featuring JC Chavez fighting the dead Ivan Robinson. But I'm buying the card for Rafael.....
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JV
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 07:09 am:   

I guess I just think Hatton is a punk who is too scared to fight outside of Manchester. I want Tzyu to beat him just cause Tzyu has the bigger balls. I honestly don't know what will happen there.

I don't think Hopkins will take on Wright. Although it would be interesting from the perspective of the ways Hopkins would try to break Wright down, I think.

Thanks for that info re the Chavez card--I wasn't gonna order it. But will now.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 07:29 am:   

That's his manager, Frank Warren. If Hatton had a brain, he'd move to LV where he could get good sparring. But where else but Manchester could Tzyu make almost 6 million? That fight wouldn't draw flies in the states. Warren can make a lot of money fighting Hatton in Manchester--that's why Rickey stays. As for the fight, I think Tzyu should be installed as a solid favorite, but Tzyu's got some age on him and if Hatton gets though four or five rounds, it''ll get interesting.

Re: Chavez card. If you get HBO Latino, they rerun the fights, but they're easy to miss. Just a thought.
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Dave G.
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 08:28 am:   

My cable died after eight rounds, but I guess it did not really matter. Tito had fleas jumping off him all night. He looked like a bad sparring partner. It was like one of those bad Hollywood fights where they guy gets pulled out of the audience to fight The Champ and gets his head bounced around by a staccato jab all night. Tito es finito. I wouldn't pay one centavo to see a Hopkins or Wright rematch. Winky is going to go on to be one of those fiercely competent, but unexciting, non-marquee champs.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 08:38 am:   

"Winky's going to go on to be....etc."

What's he been til now? :-)

Jeff's point is a good one--got to get his dad out of his corner, but since that'll never happen, yeah, retire.
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Dave G.
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 11:37 am:   

Don Felix is definitely in La La Land. He seems to be delusional, or else afraid to damage his son's self esteem.

Seems like, with his vaunted power not following him up to 160, he has nothing to bail him out when his skills fail him.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 11:48 am:   

That's been enough against everyone but two, but yeah....
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jv
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 02:42 pm:   

Yeah, that HBO Latino pisses me off. Half the time the listing is for a movie and then you happen to turn to it and...holy crap...there's boxing on. Really irritating.

Yeah, I know it's Hatton's manager. Shouldn't take it out on Hatton. And you're right about the money. It should be a very interesting fight.

The thing about Winky--if no one can take him out of his comfort zone, well, then I think he deserves the accolades. I do think he should have gone for the knockout against Tito in rounds 10-12. He could have taken him.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 15, 2005 - 03:13 pm:   

The thing is, Winky's always gotten his due from the hardcore fan and the fighters themselves, but he's never gonna get over with the rest of the public, because his style's not crowd-pleasing. Imagine if all you ever saw John McEnroe do was hit a forehand against a wall. It's not in Winky's character to go for the KO, especially since Trinidad carries his power late.
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, May 29, 2005 - 01:24 am:   

What I was going to post in the other thread...

Hi Lucius.

How good was the Chavez fight? I hear that in any other year it might have been fight of the year.

I'm talking about Jesus Chavez's fight, of course. Like I said, that one HAD to be a good one.

As for the headliners, I don't care what happened in their fight, but JCC and Robinson need to retire. Hidings to nothing. I'm shuddering just thinking about either one of these guys in ten years.

But hey, Chico and JLC at 135, despite what I'd read everywhere and knowing the result, I honestly really did stand up and scream when I finally watched it. About five different points in the bout, I turned to my old man and said "Bloody hell", and he was staring past me at the TV like the Virgin Mary was doing a striptease. Fuck, my old man even tried to stand up when that last left hook went in, and he's missing his right leg below the knee.

All the best,

Nels.

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Nels
Posted on Sunday, May 29, 2005 - 01:31 am:   

Sorry, last post, promise, but I have an involved and longwinded apology for being completely wrong about Ricky Hatton's fight next weekend that I can share, if anyone wants to hear it. Any interest on that fight, guys? (Or I could shut up, in which case can anyone please recommend a decent online boxing forum?

By the way Winky bores me too. A million years ago I saw him fight Adrian Dodson at the London Arena. He was conservative, strangely awkward, very dull but very effective. I haven't cared to actually WATCH him since.

Take care,

Nels.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 29, 2005 - 06:16 am:   

Nels, both the Marquez and the Famosito fight were excellent. Chavez-Famosito was basically Castillo-Corrales lite, both fighters being less skillful and powerful. I thought Famosito won, but couldn't argue too much with the judge who had it 115-113 Chavez. But the judge who had it 117-111 was watching some other fight. Basically two guys in a phone booth. Famosito was the better inside fighter and Chavez did best when he created distance. Since the fight was fought mainly at close quarters, but at a distance Chavez landed the more visible clean punches, so....

The Marquez fight was surprising. Vargas was a terrific boxer and gave Marquez fits. He also knew this was his last shot at a title and thus he fought his ass off. He was hurt four or five times during the fight, cut, and finally knocked down in the 12th, but fought back each time. I doubt he would have finished the 13th, but he way he was fighting, you never know.

The Chavez-Robinson was just tragic. I switched it off after a few.

Sure, let's hear your Hatton stuff. Everyone I know is interested in that fight.


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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 29, 2005 - 06:18 am:   

Meant to say, Since the fight was fought mainly at close quarters, I thought Famosito edged it out, but...
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, May 29, 2005 - 06:21 am:   

Are you going to the Hatton fight?
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Nels
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 06:09 am:   

Hi Lucius.

Sorry to take so long getting back to you -- work sometimes intrudes.

Yes I am going to the Hatton fight, and I'm worrying that if Hatton DOES lose maybe I should've asked for riot armour for my birthday.

Anyway: a guy I know who works for a Certain Promoter had confided that no way would they let Hatton have a crack at Kostya; like a schmuck I believed him, inferring in my cynical way that his braintrust knew something we all didn't about the whitest white boy on the planet.

Hold my hands up man: I was sold a wrong 'un.

Now they're getting it on, and after watching tape after tape of Tszyu, I actually think his deteriorating footwork will let him down. Hatton CAN box conservatively whilst maintaining a high workrate; Hatton doesn't get hit as often as everyone thinks and everyone seems to believe that Zoo is some kind of 140 pound Mike Tyson.

He's not. He obviously KOs people when he gets a clear shot at their chin, but he nails them due to his timing and guys steaming into him / pulling back amateurishly.

The way to beat this guy is not to offer your chin up on a plate. I don't think he's as effective an offensive force as everyone thinks. Mitchell (II), Judah, Hurtado, even Rodriguez all basically tried to trade with him, punch for punch, or committed some other basic flaw. The way to do it is to stand your ground and keep turning him, which I think RH will do.

I actually see quite a boring fight for the first half, until the old guy gets desperate and realises he's behind. Then he'll be the one turning it into a street fight, not Hatton; and then we'll see exactly what we shall see.

My pick is Hatton late or on points.

All the best,

Nels.

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Nels
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 06:15 am:   

PS: And another thing: believe it or not, I can't remember a time when there were so many high profile fights in which the outcome was so much in doubt.

Castillo-Corrales, Hatton-Zoo, Morales-Pacman, even to a certain extent PBF-Gatti and Taylor-Hopkins, all of them a right bitch to call.

That's good, IMO. It's the thrill of boxing -- it's unpredictability -- and that's why I was banging on the other day about "a new Golden era".

(Even though I've officially called Hatton-Zoo the butterflies are still whizzing around my internals, as it were).

Right.

Speak to you after the fight.
-- Nels
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JV
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 06:35 am:   

Tszyu wins with a TKO in the ninth round. He weathers the first two rounds of Hatton aggression, while effectively counterpunching, then turns up the pressure. Meanwhile, Hatton will probably be bleeding by the fifth or sixth round, creating an additional problem for him.

Tszyu doesn't need great footwork to get to Hatton or avoid him. And he looks more like he's enjoying himself than at any time in his career.

I think Hatton's a good action fighter, but that's about it. I also have to say that I don't think Hatton can be considered a great fighter if he never leaves Manchester.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 07:12 am:   

Yeah, Nels....Know what you mean about needing armour. I used to go to a lot of fights at the Olympic, which had a big Mexican fanbase. They used to thow beer bottles filled with piss from the cheap seats.

Like you, I think Tzyu has been made into King Kong by the media. He hasn't really beaten anyone except Judah, who could have easily outboxed him but gave him his chin. Still, this is a major step up for Hatton.

I see it different than Jeff. I think it's Hatton who has to weather the early rounds. It's his first really big fight, and he's going to be nervous. I can see him losing focus and being drawn into an exchange and getting caught early.. No way I can call this fight with any degree of certainty. Too many variables. Tsyu's age, Hatton's inexperience, the crowd, whether he can adhere to his plan. I'm tipping tiward Tzyu, but I'm gonna over think it before I make my pick. :-)
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JV
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 08:04 am:   

I don't know squat. I just like Tsyu. LOL.

Re weathering the early rounds--I think Hatton's gonna be totally relaxed in front of his Manchester homies.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 08:23 am:   

I don't know about that, Jeff. Fighting at home has been good for Hatton, but this is the first fight he's had which he stands a good chance of losing, and that kind of pressure not to be embarrassed sometimes works against you. I've seen it happen before and I'd be surprised if Hatton isn't affected. Here's hoping he errs on the side of caution.
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JV
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 08:27 am:   

Well, that's true--I think it happened to Cory Spinks versus Zab Judah (a fighter I really dislike).
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Dave G.
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 08:49 am:   

I have not yet had a chance to see Hatton, so my opinion on this fight is uninformed. I just can't help thinking that an arena full of lagered-up Mancs could induce Hatton to press too quickly and ignore his fight plan. That might play into the hands of the guy with the big-fight experience. We've seen it happen again and again.
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Lucius
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 09:01 am:   

It's a distinct possibility. But it could have the effect of making him cautious. I think Nells has it right. Hatton's gonna be cautious, try and outbox Tzyu and late, that's when we'll see the fight. WIll Tzyu have absorbed too many body shots by then to be effective, or will Hatton not have done enough work to weaken him? That's the key, I think.
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Lucius
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2005 - 03:53 pm:   

Tzyu came in 3 pounds over the weight and has to hit the sauna. Not a good thing for the older and more inactive fighter.
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 04, 2005 - 08:05 am:   

Hatton looks in great shape, but I can't go against Tzyu in this one. Tzyu by mid-rounds stioppage...

But I'm pulling for Rickey....

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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 04, 2005 - 07:41 pm:   

Hatton by 11th round TKO. Should have stayed with my gut. Tzyu may have grown old in the ring tonight. Tzyu had never fought a real pressure fighter before--he didn't appear up to it. I thought he was bound to land one flush right hand, but Hatton did a good job defensively...make that a great job. I had it an easy win for Hatton, had him ahead by five.

He's got to lose that nickname, though. There's only one Hitman. He was doing better when he was known as the Hitter.

The ref did a terrible job--he should have broken them much earlier on many occasions, but I don't think that would have changed things tonight. It was Hatton's night.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 05:57 am:   

This is what I posted on my boxing board after watching the fight again:

After watching the fight three times, I agree with those who said that this was more-or-less the same Tzyu of recent vintage and that Hatton gets a lot of credit for the victory. If Tzyu got old overnight, it was Hatton who aged him.

What surprised me was in the first few rounds how Hatton was muscling Tzyu about. He looked every bit as strong as Tzyu and I think that's when Tzyu knew he was in for a long evening. I think the ref was not as bad as I first thought. He let things go on too long on a few occasions, but I've seen a lot worse. As to the low blow, hey, that's the rule--he hits you low, hit him low. You notice Tzyu didn't hit Hatton low after that. It was a kind of Who's your daddy moment. Hatton won all the big psychological moments in the fight. He broke Tyzu's will, which is what fighting is all about. Kostya Tzyu, though a gentleman, has not been adverse to bending the rules in the past and did so in this fight. He met up with a guy who gave him tit for tat in that department and like KT said, He beat me in every way tonight. I had Hatton up by four going into the 12th, apparently the same score approximately that Tzyu had.

As to Tzyu quitting like a dog, what a load of bollocks! I don't want to hear that shit about anyone who steps inside the ring and I don't care if this gets me in trouble with Bucket, anyone who says that about Kostya Tzyu doesn't know his ass.
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JV
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 08:19 am:   

It was a good fight. I was waay wrong, of course. But I also agree that Tzyu didn't quit like a dog. I also thought he was way behind by the end of the 11th, and why take another three minutes of beating at that point?

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 08:34 am:   

Exactly. There's a lot of old farts out there who think you have to die in the ring to get respect. Generally speaking, they've never been in the ring. They remenber the bad old days when fighters were manipulated and used up by their managers. Today the top athletes aren't going to be chumped that way. Tzyu has a lot to live for, family, a good life. He was a beaten man and he knew it. He did the right thing.

Don't worry about being wrong, Fights like this, there are just too many variables to do more than make an educated guess.
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 11:24 am:   

Hey guys.

What a night. Too frazzled to type much; on just about everything I agree with Lucius, for what it's worth. I don't think anything less of Kostya. He looked fucked from about round eight on.

Big respect to both guys. Not pretty from where I was watching, but a frigging hard fight. Hatton versus Mayweather/Gatti winner, anyone?

Take care,

Nels.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 11:38 am:   

I guess Hatton wants Corrales next, Nels. I don't know about Mayweather. He's so skillful and I have difficulty envsioning a Hatton win.

Hope you had a blast!
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 12:11 pm:   

Yeah sorry -- wasn't predicting a victory there, just ruminating that it'd make Hatton the biggest sports star in this country if he beats the winner of that one.

Lucius, straight up about Hatton/Corrales?

I mean... Fucking Hell. If that happens in the States, I shall be raiding the piggybank for air-fare.

Take care

Nels (going back to bed)
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 12:25 pm:   

That's what Warren said after the fight, that they wanted Corrales in Las Vegas. Intriguing fight, Does Corrales carry his power up to 140? Is Ricky walking into an uppercut machine? Stay tuned.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 06:50 am:   

I don't think Tszyu "quit like a dog," because I think a fighter's health and well-being come first. But that having been said, I would have liked to see him finish on his feet; it's hard to watch a great champ go out that way.

I didn't score the bout myself, but my intuition is that I would have scored it fairly close. And I didn't think the two low blows were comparable; Tszyu's was on the beltline. Hatton's was square on the sack. I would have scored the Tszyu punch a knockdown. It was pretty clear the ref was giving Hatton the benefit in subtle ways, and this was part of the reason Tszyu figured it wasn't his night.

But all credit to Hatton. He roughed the guy up, walked through his best shots and wore him down. A solid win, despite the somewhat unsatisfying conclusion. And a great display of camaraderie and sportsmanship by these two guys. An exciting fight.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 07:00 am:   

Doesb't the fact that he had a broken jaw and was advised by his corner to quit factor in?

If there had been two low blows, I'd agree with you, but Tzyu was hitting low throught the fight. After Hatton's low blow, he stopped.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 07:48 am:   

Ah, didn't know about the broken jaw. Yeah, that would indicate that enough was enough. I didn't suspect the busted jaw, since Kostya didn't mention it and seemed to be speaking normally afterwards.

Bottom line: A tough old champ who had weathered some recent injuries just couldn't rumble with a younger, stronger, rougher, more energetic guy. A definite changing of the guard.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 06:46 am:   

So, someone has finally driven a stake through the heart of Mike Tyson's career. The end of an era, of media exploitation if not of fistic excellence.
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JV
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 07:03 am:   

Lucius:

I'm debating ordering the Mayweather-Gatti fight tonight. Any reason I should?

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 07:12 am:   

You know, I'm debating it too. The undercard sucks. It seems like a pre-scripted fight, Floyd by UD or late stoppage. But when Floyd's on, he's capable of painting a masterpiece and Gatti just might catch lightning in a bottle, though IMO it would rank right up there with Lourdes. I'm probably gonna buy it and hate myself for doing it afterward :-)
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JV
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 07:24 am:   

LOL! That's what I was just thinking--re the buying it and hating myself afterward. But...I'll probably still do it. Hope springs eternal, and all that.

JeffV
PS Got your movie review book. Just fucking awesome.
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 07:32 am:   

Well, we can beat ourselves up in the morning.

Thanks about the book. Deborah did a great job...As y ou can tell by my typing on the board, my typos are legendary and she deserves great praise for fixing that alone.
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Nels
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 09:36 am:   

If I may slip in my tuppenyworth here, guys...

Mayweather by TKO late. Gatti's fun to watch, but I just can't see how he'll deal with Pretty Annoying Boy. Too quick. Unless...

Unless someone shows him a tape of either McCallum vs Curry or Forrest vs SS Mosely 1. In other words time the son of a bitch for a counter, or jab with him to nullify the flash.

Then again, Gatti hasn't the technical ability of McCallum or the height and reach of Forrest. I thought Castillo did a decent job of containing Floyd with intelligent pressure in both their fights, but I don't think Gatti's half the inside fighter JLC is. Quicker hands, maybe, but not as solid or good defensively.

As much as I'd be happy as a piggy-wiggy rolling in a certain substance if Gatti lands something drastic, I cannae see it.

Ah well. At least they're showing it free'n'live over here...

Take care,

Nels.
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 09:50 am:   

I agree, though I'm pulling for Floyd. He's capable of painting a masterpiece, and I like to watch. Further, I hate his fan base--all those Long Island wanna be Sopranos who've got Kiss Me, I'm Italian spelled out in fake rubies on the mud flaps of their Olds, plus which the fight's become a racist thing over here, with lots of white dudes pulling for Gatti to "knock that nigger out," and then, too, I've never forgiven Gatti for Joey Gamache -- if I were Gamache's dad, I'd have Gatti and the state of New York tied up in court til they squeaked....

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JV
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 09:51 am:   

Nels:

I think you're right. But...free? You bastard!

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 09:49 pm:   

Floyd painted a masterpiece TKO 6

Hatton-Mayweayher, anyone?
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JV
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 12:24 pm:   

Yeah--that was awesome.

And throw in the upset loss by Vivian Harris against Awkward Rubber Man and I'd say it was worth the money.

JeffV
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 12:34 pm:   

Hi guys.
Mayweather:
Lead left hooks! Counter uppercuts from three feet away!

This generation's SRL, anyone?

Harris/Maussa: Y'know that noise that my (fore) namesake from the Simpsons makes? Kind of like "Nyah-hah!"? That's the noise I made when that last left hook went in. Maybe Junior Witter can relieve Maussa of the belt (I can't see Carlos holding it long, unless he fights Jeff Resto again) and set up a unification with Hatton...?

Best,
Nels
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 12:39 pm:   

Hi Lucius.
On the possibility of Hatton/Mayweather: bring it on, I say. Let's see if Hatton can deal with a guy twice as fast as he is; let's see if if Mayweather can deal with a guy as determined as Rickaaaay (as they say in his home town).

As you say, I don't think there's anything to be gained from keeping these two apart...
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 01:37 pm:   

Well, I gotta say, we may have to make a small wager on this. I like Ricky and I think his style would be the one style that would give Floyd some problems, but nonetheless, I gotta go with PBF. He's a monster. Trains his ass off. Tremendous stamina. And he's carrying pretty good power since his hand surgery. Rickey's going to get hit with combinations coming in and he'll have to absorb a lot of punshment. Also, FLoyd's a terrific inside fighter. In this match-up, Rickey's work rate is all he's got going for him. And Floyd loves being the villain. He doesn't duck anyone, so if this fight can't be made, it's on Frank Warren. I agree, let's see it.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 01:43 pm:   

Re Harris-Mausa....Who was monitoring Harris' training? Not Steward. I've never seen a guy less prepared mentelly for a fight. That was horrible. Yeah, and Maussa won't hold the title long. I doubt he'll win a rematch.

Jeff, wasn't that spectacular? Gatti at welterweight, whose ranks he's now promising to invade, is a horrid picture. But Floyd...Wow. I think he can beat Judah right now.
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JV
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 02:55 pm:   

It was truly spectacular. PBF *is* a monster. I just can't seen Hatton beating him. He's like a machine. As soon as Hatton tried to get close, PBF would start eating him alive.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 08:16 pm:   

Well, I don't know. Rickey IMO will give PBF some difficult rounds. He's younger and faster afoot than Gatti, and his high work rate will put Floyd on the defensive--I expect a tough first few rounds, but i believe he'll take a lot of punishment. I think Rickey is a very good, but Floyd is great, possibly an all-timer. I think of Duran and Jofre and a couple of others I'd favor over him, but a top five lightweight all-time.
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JV
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 01:38 pm:   

Care about the Hopkins fight this weekend?

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 01:44 pm:   

I'm gonna watch. It's kind of bad fight to pick. On paper, you got to like the challenger. He's gonna cone in at 170 plus, he's got a great jab, he'll make Hopkins work well beyond what he used to....but he's never had a huge fight before...It's sorta interesting and the last big fight for a while....So yeah, I'm interested.
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JV
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 02:01 pm:   

Anything good on the undercard, in your opinion?

Jeff
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 02:11 pm:   

The Montiel-Morel fight is off. Morel busted for sexual assault. Don't know what will replace it, but that was a cool match-up. Larios-McCullough is no good. McCullough should be banned from fighting--he's taken way too many shots. Vernon forrest's debut at junior middle is sort of intriguing. Answer: Not really.
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Nels
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 09:54 pm:   

Hello guys.

I'm going to watch, but I totally agree that the undercard's crap. Morel-Montiel only made sense to me to build toward a 115 lb unification with Martin Castillo; I think the fight itself would've been kinda dull. I would've watched, though.

I've heard scary things about Wayne Mc, he should've hung them up after the Scott Harrison fight, if not before. His bag all along has been an easy to hit pressure fighter who engages in wars of attrition to beat you, and the boy's been going life and death almost every fight since the Yakushigi (sp?) fight ten years ago. Jose Luis Bueno beat the shit out of him, and he's been hit by hundreds of thousands of punches since then.

The main event's a bugger to pick isn't it? As Lucius said, when the challenger's so damn big and young enough to be Ex's SON, there's too many question marks... Can't miss it, myself.

Be lucky,

Nels
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, July 12, 2005 - 10:26 pm:   

Remember what Morales did to Wayne Mc? Jesus, the guy's been in with the sharks and he has not come through unscathed.

I was interested in the Montiel fight. Mark Johnson, who was my p4p champ in the 90s, surprised him and took his title toward the end of his career, but I wanted to see if he had learmed anything, if he could ko Morel.

Yup, the main event is the reason to watch. If
Taylor doesn't let Bhop lull hin to sleep, if he takes the lead and uses that jab, he could win handily....but carrying out a plan against Bhop is hard to do.
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Nels
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 12:59 am:   

Jesus dude yes, Morales-McCullough. That was painful to watch, the way Morales loaded up and hit him flush with right hands. I shudder to think what the guy's going to talk like in ten years. Wayne also walked through a few pretty solid punches from Hamed, who could at least hit hard.

McCullough's chin is too good for his own good, if you know what I mean. He could even win against Larios, who I look at as solid journeyman fare, but as you said he's already taken enough head shots, thank you.
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Lucius
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 04:13 am:   

I'm afraid McCullough's a lost cause. Larios is, as you say, a journeyman, but he'll still put dents in Wayne's skull. I know too many guys with pugilistic dementia to want to watch this. I plan to have a few cocktails during that fight and miss it.
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JV
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 06:40 pm:   

This is gonna be a fun Saturday. Based on Lucius' recommendation, we're gonna skip the undercard, drive up to Atlanta, see Weezer, The Bravery, and the Dead 60s in concert Saturday and then catch the tail end of the last undercard and the Hopkins fight.

You know, I refuse to make a prediction. I'm bad luck. I picked against Hatton and lost. I really want Hopkins to win, but if I pick him, he'll lose, so I refuse.

Yeah, McCullough's a lost cause. I agree. He's one of those action fighters who doesn't age well cause he takes too much punishment. Really a lot of respect for him, but he oughta stop.

Did I read the Max Boxing site right? Forrest is going up against a guy who is 6-0?!?! Geez. Couldn't he have found somebody with a little more experience as his comeback fight?

Jeff
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JV
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 06:42 pm:   

And Corrales-Castillo are going to go at it again in October. I don't know if it can possibly match up to the first fight. And if it does, will either of them be worth anything afterwards?

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 07:09 pm:   

Forrest has been inactive for a long while and is moving up in weight, so it makes sense he wants a soft touch.

McCullough should have quit years ago. He was shot when Morales fought him.

Corrales could make it an easier fight by boxing Castillo and I expect he'll try and do so for a few rounds, but I expect it'll turn into a brawl sooner or later.

Paq-Morales 2 in December.
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Minz
Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 06:06 am:   

I had forgotten about the bad blood between Hopkins and Dibella.
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/columns/story?columnist=rafael_dan&id=21 08467

What's the real story on their dispute? Is Hopkins really as whack as this article makes it seem? They actually had me empathizing with a friggin fight promoter for half a second. Incontheivable!
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 08:20 am:   

I know di Bella from Newfield's gatherings and he's a good guy. He did a contract with BHop years ago and Bernard got it in his head that he was screwed--which was far from the case. Bhop is a crabby guy and once he gets in his head you screwed him, that's it. So yeah, he's whack! Remind you to tell you about Di Bella's dinner wih Ike Ibeabuchi sometime....
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 01:13 pm:   

Actually, now I remember--It all stems from BHops penury. BHop went around saying that he had to pay 50K kickbacks to Lou for every HBO fight, which was patently false, and Lou sued him for Libel. He won, and won again when BHop appealed. Got an award of 600k, which has never been paid. BHop's a stingy guy. He didn't even tip til a few years ago so he took this hard...
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 06:17 am:   

Not a great fight, but then what Hopkins fight is? I had it 115-113 Taylor. I think Taylor will win more easily in the rematch.

The lowlight of the evening was McCullough-Larios. How this fight was licensed by the Nevada commision, purportedly the best in the business, I don't know. I wasn't going to watch it, but one of the people I watched it with insisted. Wayne's performance was essentially an impression of the retarded kid who thinks he can box in Million Dollar Baby. It was pitiful to watch. He was so slow. At one point Larios had backed off him, and Wayne was left doing his painfully slow bob and weave all by himself. There were long sequences when he kept his head down, not looking at Larios, and just took punches when larios was throwing from the outside that he could have avoided by just looking up. He's developed this scuttling sideways attack that makes it seem he's having trouble with his balance. McCullough was never that much, but anyone who recalls the quick-footed combination puncher he once was would have difficulty recognizing this sluggish, diminished relic. He's so clearly damaged....yet at one point, Jim Lampley spoke of his "spectacular offensive display."
Lampley ought to be shot for his call of this fight. He and Bob Costas are the biggest whores in broadcasting. Anyway, seeing something like this makes me wonder why I keep watching the sport.
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PM
Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 08:20 am:   

I'll get to see it when it replays on HBO.

I haven't been too taken with Roy Jones, Jr as an announcer. I don't enjoy watching him when the camera is on him. It's rather irking to hear him tell Jim and Larry that they don't know because they aren't boxers...
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 08:28 am:   

No, that's right. The fact that they're not boxers has nothing to do with it. Lampley doesn't know shit because he's an idiot and Merchant doesn't know shit because he's an old alky. They both shil for the house guy. Jones is an egomanic, which explains him. When I'm by myself, I watch the fights on HBO Latino whenever possible, so I don't have to listen to them.
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PM
Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 09:01 am:   

I wonder how Larry's replacement will do...I think that this is his last year.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 09:22 am:   

Nobody can do well on that show so long as HBO insist on shilling for their guys. They manufactured a champion out of Arturo Gatti, made a paper champion by feeding him chum like Mickey Ward and the like, until he was exposed by Mayweather, That;s why Showtime has taken their place as the Nunber one boxing network.. HBO's tried to hang onto their old stars, while Showtime has nourished guys like Hatton and Corrales et al. Al Bernstein's the best boxing guy on TV.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 06:20 am:   

Bernstein is definitely the best. Am I the only one out there who really misses Alex Wallau?
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 06:34 am:   

I never really liked Wallau. He was a good analysr, but he always put me in mind of a guy pitching geriitol.

I can't believe the silence on McCullough. I think the Nevada commision should be hung.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 07:45 am:   

Is the Commission pulling McCullough's license? Talk about dead man boxing. He was like a slab of corned beef out there.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 07:51 am:   

Well, maybe they will now, but they in no way should have licensed him. He's not shot, he;s fucking retarded he''s so brain damaged. Like I said on the CBZ, he looked like a child tottering forward.

And whether or not they pull it, you know we're gonna see him in the ring again.
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JV
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 08:18 am:   

Yeah--it was painful watching that fight. Really painful.

I'm not sure I agree re Hopkins--I think if Hopkins will just freakin' fight sooner he has a chance to win. Taylor didn't impress me the last four rounds especially.

I am really sick of that HBO analyst team, though. If I hadn't been in a sports bar, I would have turned the sound off.

JeffV
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 08:34 am:   

Hopkins didn't impress me the first eight. Neither fighter was impressive, But I think Taylor will be 50-75% better in the rematch.

Yeah, this was an especially bad night for Lampley. At one point during the mid-rounds he described McCullough's performance as a "spectacular offensive display..."

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PM
Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 04:52 pm:   

Perhaps he really meant spectacularly offensive display...

It's never any fun when the match is non-competitive.
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 06:54 am:   

I heard McCullough is changing his ring nickname to "The Pinata".
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 07:02 am:   

You know, that's kinda not funny...
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 07:45 am:   

Yeah, you're right. My apologies...
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 07:56 am:   

No apology necessary. Just the guy's fucking sad....you know.
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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 06:22 am:   

The one woman's fight I wanted to see has been cancelled -- I was so looking forward to Lucia Rijker-- Chrissy Martin, but Rijker just blew out her Achilles tendon. Muy Bummer...
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PM
Posted on Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 07:56 am:   

Saw the replay of Hopkins/Taylor.

Taylor showed a little life in the 12th but the momentum through the 9-11th was for Hopkins.

Taylor won it and I don't see how anyone would have judged it for Hopkins.

Though much of the time they looked for opportunity there were a number of moments where both fighters were flurrying together or in short suceesion. That was fun to watch though it really didn't do any damage.

Both fighters still appeared to have plenty left in the tank at the end of the fight. I'd say moreso for Hopkins. They could have easily gone another 5 rounds.

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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 08:37 am:   

It wasn't that great a fight. Most of the controversy has been generated by Bhop's post-fight whining. I think the rematch has a shot at being more entertaining, because Taylor has learned he needs to make Hopkins work, and Hopkins knows he has to start sooner.
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PM
Posted on Sunday, July 24, 2005 - 09:25 am:   

succession...sigh.

Hopkins may very well have thought that he was winning the fight and that has to be disappointing if he indeed simply gave his record away.

At least while they were standing around they were moving their arms. Lots of arm movement.

Presumably the rematch will answer all...

Or we may watch them watching each other for opportunity.
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Nels
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 12:57 pm:   

Hello Lucius.

I actually missed the fight on the night, and have only just seen it. Close win for Taylor on my card, but I wasn't overly impressed by him. Totally agree with your summation/hopes for the rematch.

By the by, they showed a tape delay of Martin Castillo's last defence. Have you seen this boy yet? He's a bloody smooth operator, not as flashy as fellow 115lb titlist Fernando Montiel but more technically sound. Bit of a ring mechanic, solid if not devastatingly hard puncher, very good defence. In my not-so-humble yet often flawed opinion, he's one of the best kept secrets of the lower weights.

All the best,

Nels
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 01:20 pm:   

Naw, he's no secret to me. They show his fight on Telefutura over here and I've seen him several times. Lorenzo Parra' s a good little fighter. And it absolutely floors me that Rafael Marquez is not on the P4P lists over here. I got him at number 2.

Did they show the McCullough fight?

Any news of Hatton's gonna do? Over hear, they say Cotto's next.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 01:34 pm:   

Did you happen to catch Sweet Pea Whitaker on Friday Night Fights, talking about how he was off drugs and sniffling every third word...
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 01:50 pm:   

Oh, yeah...

I'm looking for him to fight chavez
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Nels
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 03:57 pm:   

I had it taped for me, so I got to fast-forward past the McCullough fight. I don't need to see that shit.

Anyway: Cotto for Hatton, eh? 'Kin' 'Ell, it's news to me. I read that Cotto was facing the might of Silvio Branco's little brother, Gianluca, on 24th September.

As for Hatton, fook knows, mate. I shall have words.

All the best,

Nels
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Nels
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 08:06 am:   

Hello Lucius.

Hatton's next fight is live on ITV, syndicated free-network television rather than subscription- only SKY. Individuals who claim to know are pointing -- in the context of the obvious "homecoming hero" aspect of the occasion -- to the winner of an IBF eliminator bout between one Arturo Morua and Nauofel Ben Rabah (no, me neither).

If true, I'll be sick as a parrot, but not exactly surprised... This is the IBF we're talking about, an organisation whose idea of a viable contender is a guy who ponied up on E-bay for a title shot, so who knows.

Take care,

Nels.
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Lucius
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 08:19 am:   

Well, that sucks.

Maybe next he can fight Abdul the Bulbul Emir....

Cotto-Branca is ridiculous. I mean Gatti whomped Branco, right? Maybe these are just tune-ups.

Pretty great scrap this weekend. Jeff Lacy v. Robin Reid.
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Nels
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 09:19 am:   

Agreed. Reid has let me down more times than Viagra, but I'm tenuously predicting a win for him here. Never seen the boy hurt, and I think Lacy isn't all that. He IS very strong, and has a good workrate, which might get it for him on points after a dour struggle because Reid can be lazy. But Lacy's got heavy hands rather than true one-punch "whatthefuckwasthat?" power, and I believe he'll get tired of whomping Reid and having Reid just look at him.

I think Reid'll nail him with right-hand counters all night and shock everyone. He's at his best countering come-forward sorts, and can be an awkward bugger when he wants to, can Robin.

That last sentence reminds me: ask me sometime about Robin's other career.
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Lucius
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 09:50 am:   

Awkward bugger....?

Okay, I'm officially asking.
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Nels
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 10:22 am:   

How to put this delicately? Okay, I can't. One of the reasons Robin had a bit of a "career lull" a few years back, is, well... The many fine examples of "cinematic adult entertainment" that Mr Reid has starred in.

The only one that I've seen -- and I hasten to add I don't own it, 'twas morbid curiosity led me astray, officer! -- involved him feeding into the fundament of a rather past her best wannabe-starlet something so prodigious that by rights it should have come equipped with a knee joint.

Straight up. Lacey's best tactic might be to nail Reid in the cup, because believe me there can't be a lot of spare room down there.
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Dave G.
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 10:32 am:   

Jeez, I sure hope his corner brings the Enswell...:-)
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Lucius
Posted on Wednesday, August 03, 2005 - 04:26 pm:   

Thanks for that, Nels. Amazing.
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Lucius
Posted on Saturday, August 06, 2005 - 09:26 pm:   

Well, Lacy, controversy aside, dominated Reid, who was retired on his stool by his corner after the 9th. Lacy's power was impressive, especially his uppercuts. He and Calzaghe should be good.
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Nels
Posted on Sunday, August 07, 2005 - 12:34 am:   

Bloody hell, Lucius. That boy can bang. Lacy I mean. I knew Reid could (snigger).

Glad to be proved wrong about Lacy in a way; if he fights like that versus the version of Calzaghe we saw against Veit and Mkrtchian (sp?), he'll fuck Joe up too (excuse my Anglo-Saxon).

By the by, may I ask if you considered that first knockdown A) legitimate and B) fight-changing? What did the American commentators say about it?

All the best,

Nels.

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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, August 07, 2005 - 07:56 am:   

There's a lot of talk over here, people wondering if Calzaghe will take the fight. How do you feel?

As to the knockdown. well. the American announcers were pretty adamant in their condemnation of t he ref, so they didn't like it. Before I give my opinion, I'll answer your other question about whether it was fight-changing, I don't think so. Reid wasn't doing much in there except holding and frankly he looked overmatched, if not shot.. Now, the ref was a travesty. He was slow all night and, on that occasion, he did not really get all the way between the fighters. His angle to Lacy made it conceivable that Lacy did not see him--or hear him. I give Lacy the benefit of the doubt, because he has been a pretty clean fighter for the length of his career. But does that make the knockdown legit--I'd have to say No, even though I think it's a closer call then the announcers had it. But I blame the ref, not Lacy. And I blame Reid to some extent, for noy defening himself--he did a lot of complaining in the fight, which was yet another signal that he didn't want to be in there. Your view?
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 06:51 am:   

Did anyone else think that Jorge Alonzo did a wretched job refereeing that fight? He was 2-3 beats late breaking every clinch, let Lacy hit on a break and not only called it a knockdown, but penalized Reid.

Can't blame Reid's corner for stopping it. Not only was he outclassed, but obviously Lacy was playing with the house's money.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 07:10 am:   

"the ref was a travesty..."

Obviously, I did,

Reid was penalized for a head butt, which he had the grace to admit to. Neverthess, the ref should have called it a wash.

I don't see many good refs anymore. On the other hand, in MMA, which I also watch, I see nothing but good refs. The old boy structure of boxing is bringing it down.....
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 07:35 am:   

Sorry, Lucius, for some reason I must have spaced out and skimmed over the second paragraph of your post. Doh.

I thought Reid brought nothing to the table, but I also don't like watching fights where the ref seems to favor the house fighter. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth. After that "knockdown," Reid probably knew he stood no chance.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 07:56 am:   

I don't think Reid had a chance, anyway, He did nothing in the first four rounds to show a desire to win -- he was basically looking to avoid getting damaged. As for his corner ending it, they probably beat Lacy to it by a round or so.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 08:23 am:   

I thought it was humorous that someone referring to Reid's porn-film "assets" hinted that Lacy would do well to target his punches there. And it was a low blow that really led to Reid's collapse!
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Nels
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 09:32 am:   

Hi Lucius.

I've watched it again, so I had the thing fresh in my mind.

Basically, I thought the ref was awful, but the situation was exacerbated by Reid; I have never seen a British guy prepared worse -- mentally or physically -- for a genuine world title fight, and with the headbutts, the rabbit punches and all the other shit he tried to pull in the other guy's back yard I'm quite happy to think he got what he deserved.

I've heard stuff this morning about Robin allegedly "training by the pool" in Florida, and refusing to spar apparently for the last THREE WEEKS before the fight!

And you're right, Reid did look shot. He was trying to counter and they were sailing well wide. To beat Lacy I think a guy needs to snap out the stick and give him angles. He can really hit when you let him get set, but I'd like to see what happens when he has to go looking for a guy who keeps a double jab in his face. I thought Lacy looked a touch less formidable when Reid actually used some lateral movement in the 5th and 6th; but Robin had no jab, which from a guy who I saw finish in the medals from ringside at the Barcelona Olympics stunned me.

Anyway, enough.

All the best, looking forward to the autumn now man.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 09:52 am:   

Yeah, I concur pretty much. Lacy's not going to have a long run, I fear. And lateral movement does bother him, though the guys thusfar who've given it to him, he's been able to walk down. But while it lasts, he's an exciting guy, kind of a smaller Bert Cooper, and he's fun to watch.

That's a drag about Reid's training. If true, it sounds as if he's ready for the pornstar business full time.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 10:14 am:   

And what's up with that perma-cocked eyebrow? Creepy...
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 08, 2005 - 10:24 am:   

He's Bryan Ferry's cousin.
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PM
Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 06:00 am:   

Corrales vs Castillo go at it again Oct 8th.

Seems a bit soon but I guess you go with the matches that can be made...
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PM
Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 06:05 am:   

Fell asleep at then end of the Vargas match last night. Boxing after bedtime...

I guess you go with the boxers you have...

Juarez/Soto was watchable...thankfully it was first.
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Lucius
Posted on Sunday, August 21, 2005 - 07:30 am:   

Didn't watch it -- probably check it out today.
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 06:53 am:   

I'm so glad Soto did not get jobbed out of the decision. It's kind of surreal to watch one of HBO's house fighters...Lampley & Co. describe a fight completely different from the one on the screen. They were so desperate for a Juarez comeback...And that ref was doing everything he could to help Juarez out, also.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 07:13 am:   

Yeah, that's exemplary of Boxing Today. But this is hardly the first time that Lampley's called a fight that never happened -- or any other network announcer, for that matter. Cosell was also adept at it.
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JV
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 08:32 am:   

Soto fought a great fight. Juarez was just out-thought, basically. But I think Soto showed what you do to get Juarez--you advance behind the jab and keep him off balance.

I too was thinking oh great, they're gonna point-deduction him out of a win. Just like they did to another of Juarez's opponents a couple fights back.

JeffV
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Dave G.
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 08:48 am:   

Juarez is going to have problems with tall, long-armed guys who can take his punch. Soto was the roadmap for any of them to follow.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 09:25 am:   

Yeah, everybody was worried he'd get jobbed, but it worked out. Actually I thought Soto won 9 or ten rounds, so I think the judges tried hard to job him.

Juarez was never going to be special. He's too orthodox for his size to deal with guys like Soto or Morales or etc.
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PM
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 06:04 pm:   

Wasn't it obvious though that Soto deserved to have points deducted for those unsportly punches to the back of the head?

Soto was warned repeatedly. Juarez was also warned but he stopped.

The announcers were giving the ref a time about it until they did the replay and then had to admit that the ref was justified.

Certainly some would have let it slide and in fact I recall at least one really obvious low blow that didn't get called. But the ref didn't see it.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 06:28 pm:   

I don't have a problem with the first deduction; the second struck me as a borderline call.
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PM
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 06:50 pm:   

I'm willing to give the ref the benefit that he may have seen it at a more obvious angle than we did.

The camera isn't always where it should be to catch what needs to be seen.

At any rate the ref gave numerous warnings so Soto should have made an extra effort.

I think that after the first point was deducted that the ref didn't have much choice but to be consistent. It's a no-win situation for the ref because either he lets the dirty punches go and gets criticized later or he takes measures and gets criticized as well.

I kept thinking to myself I hope this doesn't end in a disqualification.

I see matches where the dirty stuff is allowed to go on and it reminds me of basketball where there's all manner of physical contact going on and it's disappointing...
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 07:13 pm:   

Sometimes the ref is out of position. I thought the second deduction occured after a blow to the side of the head.
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PM
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 07:28 pm:   

The replay which showed a different angle (I assume a different camera) seemed more supportive.

It looked like a punch pretty much straight to the back of the head.

But the initial view didn't show this...It did look as though it went more to the side of the head.

In the case of both deductions the instant replays looked convincing. But the inititial look made you wonder what the ref was seeing. Then they show the replay and it looks like it's the right call.

Of course Juarez was in motion and turning quite a bit so punches intended for the face were landing all over the place.
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Lucius
Posted on Monday, August 22, 2005 - 07:40 pm:   

Soto clearly thought he hit the side of the guy's head. What the fuck! He won....
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Dave G.
Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 06:26 am:   

I may be wrong, but it seems I recall Juarez retaliating with rabbit punches of his own and getting no deductions. Given boxing's history, I can be forgiven for believing that the ref saw the fight getting away from Juarez and wanted to do his bet to reel Soto back in.
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Lucius
Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2005 - 06:36 am:   

Yeah, how we feel doesn't mean shit. You're forgiven. ;)

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