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jeff ford
Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 10:43 am:   

SciFiction story now online today.
http://www.scifi.com/scifiction/originals/
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rick bowes
Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 11:05 am:   

Did you actually try to draw the squiggle? I did. Both times I read it.
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jeff ford
Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 11:52 am:   

Rick: I've got the scribble in my mind, but it has nothing to do with any kind of inherent order. I think they call it "confusion".
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JeremyT
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 02:38 pm:   

I can picture the scribble in my head perfectly, but alas, I cannot remember. I can remember being about one and a half, but no earlier.

Great story...
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jeff ford
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 03:34 pm:   

Jeremy: Thanks for reading and dropping a line. I appreciate it.
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 05:18 pm:   

I just read it and loved it. I agree with Jeremy, one of the best stories so far this year.

First, the characterization is really well done. I'm kind of in a similar place in my life as the character.

Sacred geometry is something that has interested me as well. It's possible that the spiral we are all in the midst of, a part of: our galaxy, is a golden spiral. If anything is going to make me believe in some sort of god, it's this kind of stuff. But it's still a mystery. There's no certainty.

1,1,2,3,5,8,13... follow the Fibonacci sequence ... to 987

Have you heard Tool's latest album Lateralus? If you haven't you should, it's pretty amazing, never mind what Lucius says.:-) It has in part, a sacred geometry theme.

Anyway, Danny Carrey, the drummer, is into sacred geometry. During the title track Lateralus' chorus, the time signatures for the drums go, 9/8, 8/8, 7/8, without staying in the same signature for more than one measure. 987.

So, the last line. Is it Pat recognizing that he'll never be able to learn to live with this paticular mystery and keep searching? Or is it him recognizing this in Esme?



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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 05:29 pm:   

Jeremy: You can remember being one and a half? Wow. What do you remember?
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jeff ford
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:09 pm:   

Stephen: Glad you liked it. I know the band Tool, but haven't heard there latest album yet. I had no idea about their drummers interest in the spiral, but that's pretty cool.
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:29 pm:   

I think it's almost up there with The Empire of Ice Cream as one of your best stories I've read. But I haven't read a story that I didn't like by you.

You often seem to write somewhat uncertain endings...

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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:42 pm:   

I hear Jewel is into Logic, too....

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jeff ford
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:47 pm:   

Stephen: Yeah, those endings. Sometimes, like life, the stuff doesn't tie up so neatly, sometimes it does. Thanks for your comments.

Lucius: Hey, if Jewel is into it, I'm down with that. If I'm not mistaken, she even wrote a whole book a poetry that got published. Got Cracker in the mail today, by the way. Will be watching. Thanks!!!
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:51 pm:   

Jeff: exactly.

Lucius: Are you comparing Danny Carrey to Jewel?:-)
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:52 pm:   

You're clearly impartial. How's that for logic.:-)
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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 06:59 pm:   

No, Danny Carrey couldn't carry Jewel's jock. I hear Madonna's into the Kaballa, man. Those rock stars are like deep.
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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 07:00 pm:   

Hope you like Cracker, Jeff...
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 07:09 pm:   

Madonna's a rock star? I thought she was just a pop whore?

It obviously works for him because he sure can play the drums. I'm not saying I'm going to follow it, but it's interesting. He sets up his kit based on scared geometry principles.

What can Madonna do well? Well, I think we all know the one thing she's good at...
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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 07:19 pm:   

Wow, yeah. The guy needs a plan to set up his kit. That' s the kind of drummer I want. Probably needs a blueprint to go to the bathroom. That's why they call it Tool.


I hear Iggy's really into astronomy.
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 07:31 pm:   

Name one current rock drummer, aside from maybe Neal Peart, who's better on the drums?

The big boys in the drumming worlds, as in Jazz, Latin, and Funk drummers, acknowledge him among some of the best "new" drummers because of what he's doing with solos, which is very innovative. For a rock drummer he's damn good.
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StephenB
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 07:32 pm:   

That should be some of the big boys.
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Lucius
Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 08:43 pm:   

Neal Peart? Don't make me......hahahhahahhahahahha...

If that's your criteria, man, Neal Peart....he's dogshit. He has no feeling, just a bunch of chops. I know jazz guys who laugh at him. Jesus...

I'm not going to pollute Jeff's board with this argument, anymore.

Neal Peart......hee hee hee
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jeff ford
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2005 - 03:10 pm:   

A couple of reviews of "The Scribble Mind" from different places around the web.

This first one is from Michael Fay at Tangent. I think Eugie Foster is doing a great job running Tangent these days despite Dave's occassional lunatic parlamblings, but this guy, Fay, who does the SciFiction reviews is like sleepwalking through these things just telling the plot, giving away what happens and in one word either dissing it or giving it the nod at the end. Fairly lame, but here it is.
http://www.tangentonline.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=456&Itemi d=264

This one Ellen sent me and is pretty in depth and from a guy who goes by the moniker of The Flea or something similar. Thanks Ellen.
http://www.livejournal.com/community/shortform/

This one is from Blujack in his reviews page at the Internet Review of Science Fiction. You have to sign up for this magazine, but I've checked it every month since it's started and they have a lot of good stuff in it.
http://www.irosf.com/q/zine/article/10154

If any one sees any others around, pro, con, or zombie, let me know and I'll put the links here.


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Ellen Datlow
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2005 - 09:57 pm:   

Jeff,
I hadn't seen Bluejack's review. Thanks for providing the link.
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jeff ford
Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 09:30 am:   

Here's another review of the story from a new, interesting website.
http://darkcabal.blogspot.com/
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m_G
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 12:05 am:   

I once read a book, I think it was called "Man and his Symbols" by Carl Gustav Jung, an oversized picture-book edition, and saw 4 pictures that were titled something like the 'primordial archetypes'. Supposedly there were about 4 basic images that everyone had in their 'subconscious' minds, that were supposedly tied to ancient roots, genetically locked in our makeup and the 'collective unconscious' of mankind as a whole. I remember bookmarking a page (leaving a little ripped piece of paper in it), returning it, then taking it out again with the intent of photocopying or scanning the image or something, and not being able to find the image anywhere. The book was sort of old, may have been damage, and may have been 'repaired', re-bound, etc. I was so certain the images I'd come across were in that book... but I remember doing searches on the internet, and it's possible that the images that I'd seen, were in fact on a website, not in the book, etc. I did searches for the images on the net, but when I found a site that seemed familiar, the pictures didn't quite seem to be what I'd remembered. I think they were fractals or something. Anyway, the original description that I thought I'd read, explained four different types of images, each following certain overall guidelines, and a single example was given of each. The idea was that certain schemes were used in images from cave paintings to the present, and within different cultures. My memory is so vague now, but it may have discussed things like mandalas as well. So that's a mostly true story, except where my memory fails me, that mirrors your story a little. The whole idea of a 'language of dreams' is related a little too, however, from that book, and other sources, no one dream dictionary is necessarily entirely correct, since each individual is unique, and a symbol must be referenced in context to that person's experiences and ... is the term enneagram? (something meaning symbol-pattern-network of the mind) Yeah, anyways, the idea was that, to find the meaning of a dream, you would have to work with the dreamer, to explore analogies that certain symbols could have within their experiences. The 'Scribble Mind' in this context, sounds like a 'universal key' to the unconscious mind. In mysticism circles, there's something called the Akashic Record (which I heard about through links in roleplaying game books, rather than true study of mysticism) which supposedly contains the sum knowledge of people's experiences, or something like that. A place where mystics can go in a meditative state, to discover knowledge that has already been discovered once, or something like that. In more 'modern terms', people might think of the Akashic Record as 'the collective unconscious', even a 'meta-organism', part of the memories and consciousness of an organism of which we are all parts, ie Gaia, etc (ie if you think of an anthill or coral reef as a single entity, with an agregate mind, that is greater than the individual cells/organisms/units, you might say the same about humans, or a given biosphere). Self-similarity, or feedback loops, is a property of fractals I believe, which some say hold secrets to how complex things are generated from seeds. Self-similarity is also key in compression of very large amounts of data; ie, you build certain core matrices of information that allows for all the asymmetries you will need to reference, and then refer back to this same thing in various ways, as various forms of symmetry of the original key/seed etc. In terms of the golden section and living organisms, the idea is more of certain patterns which are locked in, and them repeating throughout the progression; ie. a growth pattern that reflects a certain ratio which remains more or less constant.
Anyways, my grasp of it is not that solid, but I thought I would share some of my experiences with things that relate to this. I really liked the story. A book that I read that introduced me to some of these concepts was a book called "Godel, Escher, Bach", that drew analogies between a mathematician, an artist and a composer with the idea that they each tried to conceptualize some sort of truths of the infinite within their own fields, a piece of beauty that was taken from some unique understanding of reality, yet those understanding were not so different, in some ways...
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rick bowes
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 12:12 am:   

m_G: the first part of your post sounds like the start of a Jeff Ford story.
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jeff ford
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 05:03 am:   

m_G: Rick's right to some extent -- I've read all of these books you mention here and have had similar experiences, actually one with the Jung book. And I follow what you are saying; find it very interesting, especially this section here --

In more 'modern terms', people might think of the Akashic Record as 'the collective unconscious', even a 'meta-organism', part of the memories and consciousness of an organism of which we are all parts, ie Gaia, etc (ie if you think of an anthill or coral reef as a single entity, with an agregate mind, that is greater than the individual cells/organisms/units, you might say the same about humans, or a given biosphere). Self-similarity, or feedback loops, is a property of fractals I believe, which some say hold secrets to how complex things are generated from seeds. Self-similarity is also key in compression of very large amounts of data; ie, you build certain core matrices of information that allows for all the asymmetries you will need to reference, and then refer back to this same thing in various ways, as various forms of symmetry of the original key/seed etc. In terms of the golden section and living organisms, the idea is more of certain patterns which are locked in, and them repeating throughout the progression; ie. a growth pattern that reflects a certain ratio which remains more or less constant.

Thanks for posting.
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StephenB
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:18 am:   

I've been into the collective unconciousness. You were there and you were there and you were there and you were there. I have no doubt of its existence. Or is it all a dream?;)
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StephenB
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 12:17 pm:   

consciousness.
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StephenB
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 04:29 pm:   

Actually, that should really be collective unconscious. But whatever.:-)
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jeff ford
Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 06:12 am:   

Stephen: What the hell are you dithering about here? Oh well, onward!
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StephenB
Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 11:50 am:   

:-)Did I seem to dither? I was just saying how the collective unconscious is probably more real than how most people generally percieve it. I was just clarifying what I was talking about, and that was probably unnecessary. But like I said, whatever.
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jeff ford
Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 02:36 pm:   

Stephen: No problem. With the broken posts I had a hard time following. Now I get what you mean. Have at it.

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